Eldar balance focus

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Ire
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Re: Eldar balance focus

Postby Ire » 16 May 2016, 21:07

Played some more 2v2 this weekend and found a lot of anti-eldar builds.

I was trying to avoid pulsar use, and I'm feeling like the faction is very, very weak atm. Pulsars are a crutch that the race, as is, cannot survive without.

Go ahead and nerf them. But, buff up the rest of the race to compensate.

Why does the shadow only have 4 torps, btw? If torps are supposed to be a faction plus, the fact the shadow has less torps than any other (torp cruiser) takes that advantage away.

Tbh I never felt eldar were as bad as tractor orks (who have no real counter).

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MadDemiurg
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Re: Eldar balance focus

Postby MadDemiurg » 16 May 2016, 21:59

A Graduate Student wrote:Balancing Pulsars,

If we leave numbers as is:
1. make it to where pulsars reveal the ship
2. Longer CD on Pulsars (other ace level skills such as bombers(chaos) Nova cannon (IN) have 60 sec cd for about the same damage.
3. make boost go on CD with Pulsars so you cannot cheese spam and run.
4. Make turning unavailable during channel so the attackee has a chance to dodge.

For Numbers changes:
1. Make the channel longer 3s -> 4.5 or 5 (6 may be too long) if channel is longer make the damage lower so that the total damage is the same just over 6 seconds instead of 3.
2. leave the range as is. removing the range upgrade makes it to where the eldar have basically no plan except to get into suicide close range and that is game ending.


My thoughts on this:

1. This won't help much - a lot of people use running silent with pulsar, so revealing the ship when it fires pulsar won't accomplish much - it will restealth immediately after
2. These skills are not really comparable. Novas and Torps usually go as complimentary weapons on ships that have other powerful weapon systems - Eldar ships often don't have much going for them except pulsar (may change with starcannon buff)
3. This might work as one of the options
4. Think this would make them too weak

Numbers changes
1. Longer chanelling - might work if range is kept as is
2. But this is the problem that makes Eldar boring (one of the reasons I don't play them anymore). You can't really engage at close range so you try to avoid any retaliation. This is not fun for either side. To make it work with range nerf there's a need for a lot of changes (some are in my 1st post in this thread)

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MadDemiurg
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Re: Eldar balance focus

Postby MadDemiurg » 16 May 2016, 22:01

Ire wrote:Played some more 2v2 this weekend and found a lot of anti-eldar builds.

I was trying to avoid pulsar use, and I'm feeling like the faction is very, very weak atm. Pulsars are a crutch that the race, as is, cannot survive without.

Go ahead and nerf them. But, buff up the rest of the race to compensate.

Why does the shadow only have 4 torps, btw? If torps are supposed to be a faction plus, the fact the shadow has less torps than any other (torp cruiser) takes that advantage away.

Tbh I never felt eldar were as bad as tractor orks (who have no real counter).


Yeah, Eldar are not OP apart from some game modes and retarded strategies like hiding/running as defender, but they require some very specific builds to deal with and overall are not very fun to play with or against. I agree that some serios survivability buffs need to come along with range nerfs (some suggestions are in my original post)

Braincandy
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Re: Eldar balance focus

Postby Braincandy » 17 May 2016, 01:23

MadDemiurg wrote:
Ire wrote:Played some more 2v2 this weekend and found a lot of anti-eldar builds.

I was trying to avoid pulsar use, and I'm feeling like the faction is very, very weak atm. Pulsars are a crutch that the race, as is, cannot survive without.

Go ahead and nerf them. But, buff up the rest of the race to compensate.

Why does the shadow only have 4 torps, btw? If torps are supposed to be a faction plus, the fact the shadow has less torps than any other (torp cruiser) takes that advantage away.

Tbh I never felt eldar were as bad as tractor orks (who have no real counter).


Yeah, Eldar are not OP apart from some game modes and retarded strategies like hiding/running as defender, but they require some very specific builds to deal with and overall are not very fun to play with or against. I agree that some serios survivability buffs need to come along with range nerfs (some suggestions are in my original post)



The reason that the Shadow has 4 torps as compared to 6 from everyone else is likely a holdover from the table top. Eldar torps were extremely difficult to shoot down were more reliable about doing damage once they hit, so 4 torps would outperform 6 imperial ones. 9 times out of 10.

I think everyone is saying the same general thing, as Demi said. Pulsars do need to be toned down, but at the same time it is near suicide to get in close to a high level player, especially an Ork traktor/taunt spammer.

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Bludfist
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Re: Eldar balance focus

Postby Bludfist » 17 May 2016, 03:17

would it be fair say that the Void Stalker is the staw that breaks the camels back?


The eldar as a whole are manageable before they field the ship but once they get it.... :?
Chaos walking into Aldorf be like
Spoiler : :
Image

Braincandy
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Re: Eldar balance focus

Postby Braincandy » 17 May 2016, 08:05

Bludfist wrote:would it be fair say that the Void Stalker is the staw that breaks the camels back?


The eldar as a whole are manageable before they field the ship but once they get it.... :?



Sounds legit. All it does is add 4 pulsars at a previously impossible 12k range.

Another problem with Eldar is that there are so few ships. An imperial player can field torps on everything from frigate all the way up to BS and every stop in between. Eldar can only field them at cruiser and then you are saddled with the currently impossible to use starcannons. At least with pulsars you can field them at most ship sizes short of cruiser.


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