Cruiser Shadow

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NickEcho
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Cruiser Shadow

Postby NickEcho » 02 May 2016, 18:08

Is it good for anything when compared to pulsar carriers? Besides the ridiculous eldar versus eldar matches as a ram ship. The way I see it, the main problem with it is that it must keep moving, yet its weapons are mounted up front, so you can't really fire them for long enough.

My suggestion to make it useful: make its star cannons into 270 degree turrets. Then with the range and maybe accuracy upgrades, it could be taken without expecting an instant loss, instead of pulsar carriers.

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Thedrik
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Re: Cruiser Shadow

Postby Thedrik » 02 May 2016, 18:18

NickEcho wrote:Is it good for anything when compared to pulsar carriers? Besides the ridiculous eldar versus eldar matches as a ram ship. The way I see it, the main problem with it is that it must keep moving, yet its weapons are mounted up front, so you can't really fire them for long enough.

My suggestion to make it useful: make its star cannons into 270 degree turrets. Then with the range and maybe accuracy upgrades, it could be taken without expecting an instant loss, instead of pulsar carriers.


I've thought of proposing this myself, or add a Battleship without pulsars that does the same thing, maybe do both. This would give us ship(s) that is more capable of actually doing damage without pulsars or bombers being the only options. Would make strafing runs have more strength as well.

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Ivanna
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Re: Cruiser Shadow

Postby Ivanna » 02 May 2016, 19:29

It has 1 more skill slot than the Solaris, and the fact you are only ever going to use them for Eldar vs Eldar means you can specialise them for that, whereas your Light Cruiser pool is shared between the Solaris and the Aurora.

I like it. I think you need some Aconite escort frigates to go along with it, but as a tank/utility/ram/boarding ship it works quite well.

Deidryt
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Re: Cruiser Shadow

Postby Deidryt » 02 May 2016, 20:30

I ended up using my Shadows as a damage sponge... and a "recon in force" platform. They would be the only ones to push into range of the opposing fleet, and many times against Eldar, it would ram them.

I am not very impressed with the damage output of starcannons, and I found that whenever I relied upon them, they would do negligible damage for the amount of fire the Shadows would come under.

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MadDemiurg
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Re: Cruiser Shadow

Postby MadDemiurg » 02 May 2016, 20:37

I've actually managed to get some wins with them + aconite spam vs non Eldar :D, but it requires insane micro and your opponent probably needs to be drinking tea with 1 hand at the same time (and not use taunts and all the other nice stuff that usually kills Eldar @ close range) . The dps is actually decent if you manage to stay on target somehow, like when your opponent decides it's a good idea to run in assasination :D. Starcannons need tweaks for better viability across the board, not just shadows. Better firing arc has been suggested many many times, although 270 might be too much. (I feel 180 would be enough, Eldar shooting while running away is not a good thing). Also, they should be 9k range from the start, using them at 3-6k is usually suicidal.

Btw, does anyone know if accuracy penalties apply before or after holofield reduction. I was thinking about a really gimmicky but (potentially) fun build:

Essentially, holofield (-50% accuracy), brace with extended duration (-20%), void predator (try to attack from clouds or meteors, another -20%) and possibly -50% accuracy from a meteor field (take meteor damage immunity). I wonder how all this stuff stacks.

The build would be +3k starcannon range, +order duration, void predator, meteor immunity, whatever (likely dragon sails or belt armour). Most likely Biel Tan for brawling n stuff.

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Ivanna
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Re: Cruiser Shadow

Postby Ivanna » 04 May 2016, 00:07

MadDemiurg wrote:I've actually managed to get some wins with them + aconite spam vs non Eldar :D, but it requires insane micro and your opponent probably needs to be drinking tea with 1 hand at the same time (and not use taunts and all the other nice stuff that usually kills Eldar @ close range) . The dps is actually decent if you manage to stay on target somehow, like when your opponent decides it's a good idea to run in assasination :D. Starcannons need tweaks for better viability across the board, not just shadows. Better firing arc has been suggested many many times, although 270 might be too much. (I feel 180 would be enough, Eldar shooting while running away is not a good thing). Also, they should be 9k range from the start, using them at 3-6k is usually suicidal.

Btw, does anyone know if accuracy penalties apply before or after holofield reduction. I was thinking about a really gimmicky but (potentially) fun build:

Essentially, holofield (-50% accuracy), brace with extended duration (-20%), void predator (try to attack from clouds or meteors, another -20%) and possibly -50% accuracy from a meteor field (take meteor damage immunity). I wonder how all this stuff stacks.

The build would be +3k starcannon range, +order duration, void predator, meteor immunity, whatever (likely dragon sails or belt armour). Most likely Biel Tan for brawling n stuff.



Not sure how it stacks, but I've been running Shadows in a sort of Bruiser role, taking Reinforced Holofield and Wraithbourne Reinforcement on top of Brace for Impact, which combined makes it pretty much invulnerable to head-on macro fire for 20s. You can even take Taunt for the 2nd slot, which also happens to make it the single best Voidstalker killer in the game. (though I guess you could argue that Darkstar squadron would be more useful against that) Whilst they're busy focusing on your Shadows, your Pulsar-equipped ships are basically free to do whatever they want.

Especially after the upcoming Pulsar range nerf, Eldar will need to diversify their lineup somewhat against competent opponents. Taking 100% squishy Pulsar ships is going to become a death sentence.

Tanall
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Re: Cruiser Shadow

Postby Tanall » 04 May 2016, 00:53

The pulsar range nerf it seems will be packaged with a star cannon buff, at least upgrade-wise. So this might make the Shadow something worth taking in the future.

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Harlequin
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Re: Cruiser Shadow

Postby Harlequin » 04 May 2016, 06:10

I Agree mostly.

But changing the firearc even to 180° degree idosen't suite Eldar.
Better increase the firepower and basic range to make Starcannons a better fly by weapon, (but something like this was postet from the devs already, so lets wait for the next Eldarpatch (when everyone abandon their Pulsars, and trying starcannons).
In my opinion that won't change much, because, if i die, then mostly in taunt-spam & fast disruptorbomb-spams, so it's always the same in the end. it dosen't matter at all if i play, a carrier, a starcannon, or pulsar Fleets. They die and win allthe same way. :mrgreen:
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Steam-Name: "Marilyn Manson"

"We bring only death, and leave only carrion. It is a message even a Human can understand."

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menaximus
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Re: Cruiser Shadow

Postby menaximus » 24 May 2016, 20:12

Actually I like them very much. I started to use them against everybody and they do well. :)

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Re: Cruiser Shadow

Postby Beernchips » 24 May 2016, 21:59

Shadow is good vs Eldar, in case of escort spam or if you can sneak 1 in the back of enemy but the best use of Shadows is :
- Send them first like a cheerleader in a football team and see how every enemy try to catch him, using every single taunt/stasis/MWJ on him and letting your pulsar ship free of any threat :)
Repent, for tomorrow you die


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