Immediate removal of Eldar as a PVP faction

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Mav
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Re: Immediate removal of Eldar as a PVP faction

Postby Mav » 24 June 2016, 08:38

Scorch715 wrote:What do we think a normalised pulsar should be like then? I picture something along the lines of the Imperial heavy prow lance but more powerful. So perhaps a lance with 30 damage and a 12-15 second recharge? That would give the Voidstalker a 120 damage burst with its 4 pulsars, plus its starcannons, which sounds decent to me


Reducing cds on pulsars without giving the eldar a way to mitigate dmg would just result in eldars doing less dmg (less dmg alongside same strike opportunity)
If Eldars turn w/o vaul ready they just get caught (or should at least)
Well there aren't many eldar players left in-game anyway coz you know, actually playin the meta for eldar is considered toxic and cheese, real men brawl and shit
Starcannons are so shit atm I just hold fire all the time >>

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Sagranda
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Re: Immediate removal of Eldar as a PVP faction

Postby Sagranda » 24 June 2016, 09:24

Mav wrote:Well there aren't many eldar players left in-game anyway coz you know, actually playin the meta for eldar is considered toxic and cheese, real men brawl and shit


Or you know, they just don't like the design of Pulsars and the gameplay they lead to.
It is unfun for them.
Nothing to do with "real men" and "brawling" and other stuff.
If Pulsars were normal lances and we would have an actual hit and run style, then more people would play them. Of that I am sure.
I play Orkz to collect all those salty Imperial tears
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Cryhavok
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Re: Immediate removal of Eldar as a PVP faction

Postby Cryhavok » 24 June 2016, 09:25

Mav wrote:Well there aren't many eldar players left in-game anyway coz you know, actually playin the meta for eldar is considered toxic and cheese, real men brawl and shit


In multiplayer games, winning at all is considered toxic and cheese.
Do you hear the voices too?!?

Mav
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Re: Immediate removal of Eldar as a PVP faction

Postby Mav » 24 June 2016, 12:12

Sagranda wrote:Or you know, they just don't like the design of Pulsars and the gameplay they lead to.
It is unfun for them.
Nothing to do with "real men" and "brawling" and other stuff.
If Pulsars were normal lances and we would have an actual hit and run style, then more people would play them. Of that I am sure.


Or the Eldar would play the same simply because they wouldn't be able to take any return fire. As a result you'd see Eldar firing away till he's threatened and then dashing away to reposition, which, correct me if I'm wrong, but is the same as now but would take longer.
Changing pulsars into lances will not fix the underlaying reason as to why eldar play the way the do. And that is no survivebility.
Now if you were to make lances hit in 270 degree cone around you... it would make eldar play diffrent but would they still be eldar? or just chaos mk.2?

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Sagranda
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Re: Immediate removal of Eldar as a PVP faction

Postby Sagranda » 24 June 2016, 12:18

All you need to do is to increase their survive ability a bit in accordance.

And no, it wouldn't be exactly the same, only similar.
It would be in the decision of the Eldar player himself to decide when to disengage and to engage again.
As of now it is: Fire your Pulsars, run away and wait since engaging while Pulsars are on cd wouldn't make sense, rinse and repeat.
I play Orkz to collect all those salty Imperial tears
#FeelsWaaaghBoss

Mav
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Re: Immediate removal of Eldar as a PVP faction

Postby Mav » 24 June 2016, 12:26

Sagranda wrote:All you need to do is to increase their survive ability a bit in accordance.

And no, it wouldn't be exactly the same, only similar.
It would be in the decision of the Eldar player himself to decide when to disengage and to engage again.
As of now it is: Fire your Pulsars, run away and wait since engaging while Pulsars are on cd wouldn't make sense, rinse and repeat.


Isn't it the same now? The eldar decides when it is safe to fire pulsars and just runs away when it isn't. I often just float away simply coz turning to shoot would kill me. I fear that the only change instead of people crying about alpha dmg would be ppl crying about sustained dmg and you guessed it: "I can't catch the goddamn Eldar"

But If we're going with the lances idea. Just make them Faster and stronger version of imps and give them wider cone. Remove or buff starcannons to make them a viable choice.

On a side note. How do zapp orcs fare against eldar now?

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Sagranda
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Re: Immediate removal of Eldar as a PVP faction

Postby Sagranda » 24 June 2016, 13:25

It is not the same.
You have a window when you can't engage and that is while the Pulsars are on CD. Well, you can, but it is pretty ineffective.
While with normal lances you aren't bound to the CD of a weapon and it is always up to your decision.
It is a small, but important difference.

In addition you have a slightly better cone, so it offers more attack angles instead of having to face the enemy head on.
The range upgrade would/could be back, too. Depending on what else gets changed.

Also a Starcannon buff in accordance to give them a tad more burst.
So you can engage the enemy for longer. Not only with Starcannons, but your Pulsars will be ready again, too.



Ork Zzap fleets fare pretty well against Eldar, since they have a 50% chance to ignore Holofields and can field a lot of probes.
I play Orkz to collect all those salty Imperial tears
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oldman
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Re: Immediate removal of Eldar as a PVP faction

Postby oldman » 24 June 2016, 14:35

Sagranda wrote:
Mav wrote:Well there aren't many eldar players left in-game anyway coz you know, actually playin the meta for eldar is considered toxic and cheese, real men brawl and shit


Or you know, they just don't like the design of Pulsars and the gameplay they lead to.
It is unfun for them.
Nothing to do with "real men" and "brawling" and other stuff.
If Pulsars were normal lances and we would have an actual hit and run style, then more people would play them. Of that I am sure.



Funny, since the patch Eldar is the race I fear the LEAST in PVP. Of course a very very good eldar player can be very devastating. But the average player, while using eldar is a piece of cake to murder.

The only place where they are really borken is if they are the target of assassination, since they can keep away long enough to bug out.

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Solitaire_7
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Re: Immediate removal of Eldar as a PVP faction

Postby Solitaire_7 » 24 June 2016, 14:40

There are less Eldar in mp now. One mistake or wrong assessment of your enemy target and your toast. I think Orks are making a come back thanks to some late tweeking and as for the Eldar not so much. After all we are a dying race...........
"Let your enemies fear, for a Harlequin of the Laughing God dances at your side."

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Sagranda
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Re: Immediate removal of Eldar as a PVP faction

Postby Sagranda » 24 June 2016, 14:47

oldman wrote:
Sagranda wrote:
Mav wrote:Well there aren't many eldar players left in-game anyway coz you know, actually playin the meta for eldar is considered toxic and cheese, real men brawl and shit


Or you know, they just don't like the design of Pulsars and the gameplay they lead to.
It is unfun for them.
Nothing to do with "real men" and "brawling" and other stuff.
If Pulsars were normal lances and we would have an actual hit and run style, then more people would play them. Of that I am sure.



Funny, since the patch Eldar is the race I fear the LEAST in PVP. Of course a very very good eldar player can be very devastating. But the average player, while using eldar is a piece of cake to murder.

The only place where they are really borken is if they are the target of assassination, since they can keep away long enough to bug out.


I fail to see what that has to do with my post :?:

But to what you are saying:
I only feared a good Eldar with my close range brawler Ork fleet back in the day, since it was a pain in the ass to catch them.
With everyone else I never had a problem.
After the Zzap upgrades, well, who wants some roasted shiny helmets?
I play Orkz to collect all those salty Imperial tears
#FeelsWaaaghBoss


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