Lets us talk about the new Ork balance changes and you

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MysticForce
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Re: Lets us talk about the new Ork balance changes and you

Postby MysticForce » 10 June 2016, 01:21

Well, I'd love to test how Red Sunz augmented by Zzaps work after the patch...but I can't get a game. 15 minutes waiting for matchmaking, and nothing.

Ugh.

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Spartan-089
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Re: Lets us talk about the new Ork balance changes and you

Postby Spartan-089 » 10 June 2016, 09:30

MysticForce wrote:Well, I'd love to test how Red Sunz augmented by Zzaps work after the patch...but I can't get a game. 15 minutes waiting for matchmaking, and nothing.

Ugh.


Just finished up a night of play testing just that, can confirm against experienced (im not talking about stomping newbies) Chaos or Eldar players, the Ork match-up is nearly impossible. Im losing to players who I've destroyed with ease before the patch.

As for the changes, sure the zzaps can slow them down a bit but not enough for you to pile on the damage which is another issue. Without AP rounds you cant burst down a ship before it can get away, without taunt you can't keep a ship in place to ram it. That new speed up grade is a gaint trap, 20% chance of blowing your engine or something else is huge, then you've really auto lost as ork since you're a sitting duck. Ork ships feel like they are made of kindling now too, between fires, boarding torps/melta, and pelted by long range lances my ships seem to burn up into nothing before I can even close the gap. I'm not sure if I've yet to adapt and there is something I'm missing here, however from what I see, this patch makes the game unplayable for me against those 2 factions. I'm interested to hear other people's opinions in terms of high lvl play.
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oldman
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Re: Lets us talk about the new Ork balance changes and you

Postby oldman » 10 June 2016, 09:35

Spartan-089 wrote:
MysticForce wrote:Well, I'd love to test how Red Sunz augmented by Zzaps work after the patch...but I can't get a game. 15 minutes waiting for matchmaking, and nothing.

Ugh.


Im losing to players who I've destroyed with ease before the patch.



well, maybe because Orks were super OP before? Orks destroyed easily ANY player unless the Ork player made stupid mistakes.

oldman
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Re: Lets us talk about the new Ork balance changes and you

Postby oldman » 10 June 2016, 09:37

Spartan-089 wrote:Ill post my concerns from the other thread and add a bit more.

My question is how are ork catching Chaos let alone Eldar now without taunt? Eldar may be "slower" now but they are still vastly faster than orks and Chaos can comfortably kite at 12k. This seems like a huge nerf for Orks all around (double fires, no more ap rounds, no more taunt). How are orks supposed to catch kitters now? That unreliable speed upgrade that can break our engines? Zzaps?, pretty sure that wont slow them enough to close the distance.

Red Suns favor seens to be MORE necessary than before than catch speedy ships.

I feel Orks are still relegated to building very specifit builds to even stand a chance. Now instead of BRB+taunt+traktor pull we have to rely on BRB (with chance to cripple your engines)+slowing zzaps+traktor pull but now with less alpha dmg(no ap rounds), less range (no more kannon range, less sensor range), and less survivability (longer fires, more damaging hull breeches).

Seems like we got more nerfs and less tools. I dont look anymore forward to playing Chaos or Eldar.



damm now you have to rely on tools that are not a single button and 100% chance of win? Damm how unfair to now have the same issues as the other races.

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Sagranda
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Re: Lets us talk about the new Ork balance changes and you

Postby Sagranda » 10 June 2016, 10:07

oldman wrote:
Spartan-089 wrote:
MysticForce wrote:Well, I'd love to test how Red Sunz augmented by Zzaps work after the patch...but I can't get a game. 15 minutes waiting for matchmaking, and nothing.

Ugh.


Im losing to players who I've destroyed with ease before the patch.



well, maybe because Orks were super OP before? Orks destroyed easily ANY player unless the Ork player made stupid mistakes.


Let me guess. You are an Imperial Navy player
I play Orkz to collect all those salty Imperial tears
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Atherius
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Re: Lets us talk about the new Ork balance changes and you

Postby Atherius » 10 June 2016, 11:15

This patch would have been fine if they hadn't nerfed Kannonz. Now that the upgrades don't count for them they're practically useless. If I could ask one thing, one favour from the developers it would be to undo that one change, to turn on the upgrades for the Kannonz. If not I predict most players will abandon them pretty quickly, replacing ships to get effective armaments.

Personally I liked having every ship having a unique weapon setup, felt very orky. One with torpedoes, one with front kannonz, one with broadside kannonz and so on. Now, kannon ships are outmoded, and replacing them with broadside gunz and the alternate torpedoes makes the fleet more uniform, less orky.

The Kannon nerf wasn't simply weakening the faction balance, its un-orky in creatuing uniformity. It not only took away from gameplay, but also from immersion.

What has been done to kannonz was a poor change.
- Please, undo it?

Pile_O_Gunz
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Re: Lets us talk about the new Ork balance changes and you

Postby Pile_O_Gunz » 10 June 2016, 12:56

I refuse to redo my fleet to use mega and zap. I don't know why they are forcing this with the rediculous kannonz nerf. I specifically went out my way to build a fleet without prow focus.

I'll give it another shot tonight if I feel they still stuck I'm going back on my break from the game till the next patch.

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Bludfist
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Re: Lets us talk about the new Ork balance changes and you

Postby Bludfist » 10 June 2016, 14:27

I want to point out how bad, mad mek suicide bomb upgrades are, not only on the practical level cause orks have to clump up so its detrimental to have this upgrade

But it also goes opposed to the philosophy of this game, half the point of the customizing, leveling up, and all other game mechanics is designed to make your ships non-expendible and furthermore to hold "value" to the player whence hy your supposed to try and warp out your ship insted of letting it get heavily damaged and your supposed to invest points in navigator so you dont get lost in the warp.

So it's an unintuitive as a design choice to create a mechanic that rewards you for your ships dying, it is at odds with game mechanics.

Furthermore im bummed that in retrospect kannoz got basically a double nerf with the loss of ap and 3000 range upgrade

I loved the torp launcher + 2 heavy gunz build but i dont think that broadside builds are viable anymore
Chaos walking into Aldorf be like
Spoiler : :
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Cryhavok
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Re: Lets us talk about the new Ork balance changes and you

Postby Cryhavok » 10 June 2016, 14:33

Bludfist wrote: your supposed to try and warp out your ship insted of letting it get heavily damaged and your supposed to invest points in navigator so you dont get lost in the warp.


I haven't tried that upgrade yet, but I just wanted to say: I never put points into navigator and once the ships are leveled, I always stop them from warping out. My orks (also IN and Chaos) are expendable as hell. I'd rather they die trying to get one more point of damage in on the enemy than warp out and waste all those points before their time.
Do you hear the voices too?!?

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Bludfist
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Re: Lets us talk about the new Ork balance changes and you

Postby Bludfist » 10 June 2016, 14:52

Cryhavok wrote:
I haven't tried that upgrade yet, but I just wanted to say: I never put points into navigator and once the ships are leveled, I always stop them from warping out. My orks (also IN and Chaos) are expendable as hell. I'd rather they die trying to get one more point of damage in on the enemy than warp out and waste all those points before their time.

Neither have i, navigator is useless for every faction and no one ever drops points in it, once you get max admirals and ships, renown becomes plentiful and meaningless and all ships become expendable as we just pay the renown to repair :P

But this is the reality for us the players but from the Dev's prospective, if they want us to struggle, to build our own narratives as we level up and care about our fleet then when implement mechanics that is the antithesis of that ideology?
Chaos walking into Aldorf be like
Spoiler : :
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