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Apocalypse-Class Battleship

Posted: 05 June 2016, 10:42
by Scorch715
Currently the IN's only lance boats are the Gothic and Firestorm, neither of which are as good as their macrocannon armed counterparts due to low dps and cannons being far more effective at their short range. Enter the Apocalypse, triple lance decks down its broadside, dorsal weapons batteries, and a Nova Cannon.

Unlike the Retribution, the Apocalypse would actually be effective at 12k range, and with range upgrades could easily engage in duels with Chaos vessels. For comparison, the Retribution has max 18dps broadsides with its turrets, dropping away considerably with range, while the Desolator has a mere 4.8dps that is admittedly far more consistent at 12k (either I've made a massive cockup calculating the max broadside dps of a Desolator, or it genuinely could do with a bit of a buff). The Apocalypse would have combined dps of 15 with its quick firing macro turrets and 3 lance decks, but would remain for more capable than the Retribution at range.

What do people think then? Would the Apocalypse have a place in BFGA, or is the fact that its far superior to the Desolator in every concievable way be too unbalanced?

Re: Apocalypse-Class Battleship

Posted: 05 June 2016, 11:36
by Delling
They have trouble balancing the game with 4 cruisers and 2 battleships per race... they won't add new ships anytime soon i'm afraid.

Re: Apocalypse-Class Battleship

Posted: 05 June 2016, 14:04
by Scorch715
Yeah I know, this was more to gauge players opinions on the ship and if there is a desire to have it in game eventually. Looking at how the TT panned out, I think its reasonably certain that eventually we'll see more ships added to each faction. Which ships and how they will be balanced is the less certain part, as ships like the Apocalypse and Armageddon are a departure from the shortrange brawling style of the in-game IN

Re: Apocalypse-Class Battleship

Posted: 07 June 2016, 22:20
by Imperator5
Actually, the Victory class is the Imperial battleship that is on level with the Desolator.

The Apocalypse is a short range brawl lancer.

TT stats

Apocalypse:
Dorsal macrocannons STR 6 Range 60cm (12k)
Nova cannon
Broadside lances with STR 6 and Range 30cm (6k)

Victory:
Dorsal macrocannons STR 6 Range 60cm (12k)
Nova cannon
Broadside lances with STR 4 and Range 60cm (12k)

So the Victory would be the Desolator equivalent, the Apoc being a kind of short ranged lance boat. Basically, an oversized Gothic. The Victory's longer range lances would have less dps than the other imperial lances by around 33%.

I do want to be able to field both.

Re: Apocalypse-Class Battleship

Posted: 11 June 2016, 22:58
by CALiGeR190
Scorch715 wrote:Currently the IN's only lance boats are the Gothic and Firestorm, neither of which are as good as their macrocannon armed counterparts due to low dps and cannons being far more effective at their short range. Enter the Apocalypse, triple lance decks down its broadside, dorsal weapons batteries, and a Nova Cannon.

Unlike the Retribution, the Apocalypse would actually be effective at 12k range, and with range upgrades could easily engage in duels with Chaos vessels. For comparison, the Retribution has max 18dps broadsides with its turrets, dropping away considerably with range, while the Desolator has a mere 4.8dps that is admittedly far more consistent at 12k (either I've made a massive cockup calculating the max broadside dps of a Desolator, or it genuinely could do with a bit of a buff). The Apocalypse would have combined dps of 15 with its quick firing macro turrets and 3 lance decks, but would remain for more capable than the Retribution at range.

What do people think then? Would the Apocalypse have a place in BFGA, or is the fact that its far superior to the Desolator in every concievable way be too unbalanced?

Apocalypse would have 9K range at best in this game, it has the same model of plasma lance as the Gothic Cruiser.
Victory has the long range lances.

Re: Apocalypse-Class Battleship

Posted: 12 June 2016, 12:55
by Scorch715
My mistake, I was using the profile for the lance turrets you get on the IN battlcruisers and the Retribution as my basis for what the lances on the Apocalypse. Seeing as Tindalos have already taken some liberties with weapon profiles anyway (e.g. the Retribution's broadside should have the same heavy plasma macros as the Emperor) , I thought using a weapon already ingame would be the safest bet.

So considering the actual stats and how they would convert into this game, the Apocalypse's lance batteries should be something like - 6k range, 15/18 damage per lance, 12 second recharge. With the accuracy and AP of lances, this would make the it absolutely terrifying up close, while being balanced by short range and poor manoeuvrability.

Re: Apocalypse-Class Battleship

Posted: 12 June 2016, 14:47
by Imperator5
Would be a rather useless ship unless its lances got a buff. The Retribution could do what it does just better.
That's why I think the Victory would be better addition, it would bring a new long range lance option to the IN akin to the Desolator.

Re: Apocalypse-Class Battleship

Posted: 04 October 2016, 12:58
by Aquilar
I like how you conveniently ignore the Apocalypse can boost it's lance range to 12K at the cost of speed as a special ability.

Re: Apocalypse-Class Battleship

Posted: 04 October 2016, 13:21
by Imperator5
Aquilar wrote:I like how you conveniently ignore the Apocalypse can boost it's lance range to 12K at the cost of speed as a special ability.


I like how conveniently you think that such an ability would translate to the game at all, or would be useful. Short range lances suck, just look at the Gothic.

Re: Apocalypse-Class Battleship

Posted: 04 October 2016, 13:52
by Aquilar
Imperator5 wrote:
Aquilar wrote:I like how you conveniently ignore the Apocalypse can boost it's lance range to 12K at the cost of speed as a special ability.


I like how conveniently you think that such an ability would translate to the game at all, or would be useful. Short range lances suck, just look at the Gothic.


or you can just give the Apocaplyse 12k range and make it the slowest battleship in the game. that works too.