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Revised opinions on the Orks and Eldar

Posted: 09 June 2016, 16:10
by CALiGeR190
Probing to see what peoples opinions are on the changes, and presenting my own opinions (pre-testing).
So far I reckon this has been a pretty awesome update (testing will prove me right or wrong)

Orks:
I feel these guys got some of the more awesome stuff.
Zzap now has a potential slowing effect and can ignore shields, lock on will dramatically increase your RoF, you can execute kaptainz without squigs, speed boosts and stealth upgrades so the loss of taunt didn't hurt them! Variety at last from the Traktor/Taunt combo (which isnt even possible anymore, THANK GOD, THAT WAS ANNOYING)!
All we need is a bomber buff and the Nova Kannon not blowing up prows and I feel the Orks will be golden.

Eldar:
This one I'm not sure on... I need to see how effective the pulsar changes have been in nerfing the 'long range, 3-shot-kill' scenarios on some capital ships, it looks like a step in the right direction though: not an outright nerf, but a re-shuffle of capabilities.
The holofeild buff through accuracy calc mods was very much needed, massed sword frigates utterly destroyed Eldar fleets at all levels
More ships is always nice for the Eldar.
the Lock on giving StarCannon a 270 degree arc is CRAZY GOOD, that alone will probably make carrier/StarCannon fleets much more viable.
Also quite a few speed upgrades... dunno if they where necessary, may make them a more effective carrier kiting fleet than the Chaos (giving us the old 'loss of role' problem we had between Orks and Imps a little while back), but I'd need to test that theory.
Also huge buff in terms of Taunt disappearing, now they are much harder to catch (also an indirect buff for all kitting fleets on first impression...).

Do people agree with me on these assessment? Anything to add? Do share!
I'll give a second verdict after I've played around a bit.

Re: Revised opinions on the Orks and Eldar

Posted: 09 June 2016, 16:18
by Halstead
Erm isn't Taunt gone and Rally taking it's place?

Re: Revised opinions on the Orks and Eldar

Posted: 09 June 2016, 16:22
by CALiGeR190
Halstead wrote:Erm isn't Taunt gone and Rally taking it's place?

I missed that, I'll make corrections.

Re: Revised opinions on the Orks and Eldar

Posted: 09 June 2016, 16:32
by Bludfist
Zzzap upgrades make orks no longer OVER RELAINT on trakktor pulls

new upgrades and shok attack mega kannon buffs make bad moons a more viable favor now

the nerf to brawling due to the removal of ap upgrade is unfortunate


But the looted ship attribute is absolutely bullshit and dosnt need to exist, why it was done i cant understand at all

Re: Revised opinions on the Orks and Eldar

Posted: 09 June 2016, 16:49
by CALiGeR190
Bludfist wrote:Zzzap upgrades make orks no longer OVER RELAINT on trakktor pulls

new upgrades and shok attack mega kannon buffs make bad moons a more viable favor now

the nerf to brawling due to the removal of brawling is unfortunate


But the looted ship attribute is absolutely bullshit and dosnt need to exist, why it was done i cant understand at all

The looted trait makes sense to me, doesn't mean I agree with it, but I get why it would be added.
The newest (and loudest) players always have problems dealing with Orks (particularly non-veteran or noob Imp players), so making it easier for them to kill them though hull crits and fires should silence some Criticism that gets levelled at Ork balance (and raise more criticism... It wasn't the best way of solving the problem).

It isn't all bad though, the destroyed ships arnt as critical for the Orks now you can execute insabordinatate captains, and Orks are still the most inherently tough faction in the game without upgrades.

Re: Revised opinions on the Orks and Eldar

Posted: 09 June 2016, 16:57
by BanjoJohn
On the subject of Eldar. They replaced the "+50 speed when only moving" with just a "+25 speed" upgrade, but its in a different upgrade spot, so they got swapped for the "cuts speed penalty for destroyed engine by 2" upgrade. Atleast I get 1/2 favor back for reselling the upgrades I dont want to get the speed upgrade back.

Still need to test things out, but I like the eclipse and shadow variants, swapping torpedoes for launch bay, or launch bay for torpedoes is a nice variant. I was just getting into the eclipse pulsar usage in a single player skirmish mode captain, not sure what I'll do without the range upgrade on pulsars. But I'm not a fan with how pulsars were implimented anyways

Re: Revised opinions on the Orks and Eldar

Posted: 09 June 2016, 17:08
by Halstead
BanjoJohn wrote:On the subject of Eldar. They replaced the "+50 speed when only moving" with just a "+25 speed" upgrade, but its in a different upgrade spot, so they got swapped for the "cuts speed penalty for destroyed engine by 2" upgrade. Atleast I get 1/2 favor back for reselling the upgrades I dont want to get the speed upgrade back.

Still need to test things out, but I like the eclipse and shadow variants, swapping torpedoes for launch bay, or launch bay for torpedoes is a nice variant. I was just getting into the eclipse pulsar usage in a single player skirmish mode captain, not sure what I'll do without the range upgrade on pulsars. But I'm not a fan with how pulsars were implimented anyways
You did lose the +50 speed when you gave the ship an attack order. The +25 speed now mean you always have speed increased at all time.

Since there's no taunt skill anymore and the bombs have a longer cooldown, it is a bit less risky to dance around edge of their detection range than outside of it. Especially now with new upgrades for Star cannons; boosting their fire rate on a single target and increasing 90 degree arc to 270 degree with Lock On! Order active.

Re: Revised opinions on the Orks and Eldar

Posted: 09 June 2016, 17:18
by BanjoJohn
Halstead wrote:
BanjoJohn wrote:On the subject of Eldar. They replaced the "+50 speed when only moving" with just a "+25 speed" upgrade, but its in a different upgrade spot, so they got swapped for the "cuts speed penalty for destroyed engine by 2" upgrade. Atleast I get 1/2 favor back for reselling the upgrades I dont want to get the speed upgrade back.

Still need to test things out, but I like the eclipse and shadow variants, swapping torpedoes for launch bay, or launch bay for torpedoes is a nice variant. I was just getting into the eclipse pulsar usage in a single player skirmish mode captain, not sure what I'll do without the range upgrade on pulsars. But I'm not a fan with how pulsars were implimented anyways
You did lose the +50 speed when you gave the ship an attack order. The +25 speed now mean you always have speed increased at all time.

Since there's no taunt skill anymore and the bombs have a longer cooldown, it is a bit less risky to dance around edge of their detection range than outside of it. Especially now with new upgrades for Star cannons; boosting their fire rate on a single target and increasing 90 degree arc to 270 degree with Lock On! Order active.



With 3-4 LC carriers you could cruise around only using move orders and just let the bombers attack on their own, you'd always be on a move order and never be on an attack order, so set ups like that have gotten a little slower, but other set ups involving attack orders have gotten faster if you do take the upgrade.

Re: Revised opinions on the Orks and Eldar

Posted: 09 June 2016, 18:39
by Solitaire_7
Eldar get more load out choices now with missions thanks to the extra cruiser class that is a shadow carrier and the vaul variant of the eclipse with torps is handy. Those changes are subtle but very welcome ! Glad taunt is gone. It never made much sense to me in a spaceship battles game, a medieval period rts sure but in space lol. Overall the Eldar fleet feels more dynamic/challenging. Having to use the cognative thingy now. Rarely if ever did use it before the nerf/patch there was rarely any need. Shame they didn't take a little more care with the initial Eldar release but hey-ho.

Re: Revised opinions on the Orks and Eldar

Posted: 09 June 2016, 18:53
by aprg
Arguably the +50 speed upgrade while not attacking was to strong, but I don't understand why they also increased the time on Wraithbone Shift or whatever it's called. Now Eldar are noticeably slower. You absolutely need that +25 speed upgrade now just to ensure Chaos doesn't catch you.