Slannesh spam hard counters the shit out of Space Marines.

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MYNAME?
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Slannesh spam hard counters the shit out of Space Marines.

Postby MYNAME? » 02 October 2016, 01:44

OK so i havnt played in months. so i decided to roll with decked out Desolator MoS and 4 hellbringers MoS vs this Space Marine guy. Not sure if he was any good or not. Anyway this doesnt take away from my analysis or whatever.

Lets look at the Space Marine Faction.

Decent ships with ok guns and an overliability on boarding (Boarding, Lightning strikes, Boarding Torpedos)
Fast
Bloody EXPENSIVE.
Hard as nails.
I am pretty sure the Space Marines fair very well in TT But not against some Races in BFG.

In a 700 point game while i had 5 ships he was barely able to bring out a Battle Barge and 2 Cruisers. I literally cheezed him to death.

Space Marines main form of damage is done with boarding (Ability based) MoS prevents abilities from happening. By chain Slanneshing him i effectivly cancelled out a giant chunk of his DPS/DPM. with 5 fully functional ships i just simply made the Barge irrelevant. He quit on the spot when he noticed what i was doing which was pretty much trolling at that point. It was bad enough that he couldnt even touch me with his ordnance and torpedos in the first place. He didnt have enough ships to put out enough damage to counteract the debuff.

What do you guys think should be done to Prevent this from being so severe.

My solution is to tone down the MoS Debuff. Maybe reduce it by 15 seconds so ships cant be chained indefinantly. OR Make Space Marine ships slightly cheaper.

MoS on a few ships is not OP I agree but when you have it on 5 or 6 ships it gets kind of Rediculous. An ability that can Hard Counter 2 races (Orks and SM) is just no good to me)

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Ashardalon
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Re: Slannesh spam hard counters the shit out of Space Marines.

Postby Ashardalon » 02 October 2016, 02:28

slaanesh has 7k range(?)
i can understand you fing up his regular boarding but how were you avoiding his torps
your fleet also sounds very BB ramable
also dont see how it counters orks , as someone who's main fleet is goff orks you can still boost under slaanesh so the orks main weapon is still online, if you where SM and i needed my torps i could agree to that assessment but vs chaos... sure it will hurt but all favors do (damn you watercaste why are your escorts so dodgy! :lol: )
does hardcounter eldar tho (which makes lore sense)
p.s. any advice keeping track of how long till something like that runs out, i never get the timing right
meaning im either wasting skill time or have a moment in between, any tips would be appreciated

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Re: Slannesh spam hard counters the shit out of Space Marines.

Postby MYNAME? » 02 October 2016, 05:29

Ashardalon wrote:slaanesh has 7k range(?)
i can understand you fing up his regular boarding but how were you avoiding his torps
your fleet also sounds very BB ramable
also dont see how it counters orks , as someone who's main fleet is goff orks you can still boost under slaanesh so the orks main weapon is still online, if you where SM and i needed my torps i could agree to that assessment but vs chaos... sure it will hurt but all favors do (damn you watercaste why are your escorts so dodgy! :lol: )
does hardcounter eldar tho (which makes lore sense)
p.s. any advice keeping track of how long till something like that runs out, i never get the timing right
meaning im either wasting skill time or have a moment in between, any tips would be appreciated


My 4 Hellbringers pretty much cancelled out any torps. He did try to ram but missed with every attempt.

I was literally in the SMs front lawn. Me n him closed in on each other and i was just sticking around 6-9 k most of the time just using MoS on him until he left the game. Also When i play vs Space Marines i generally get as much ordnance i can get my hands on. And occasionally have one ship take down fighter screens for me

Well. MoS is really good against Tractor Spamming orks. Depends on how you play? It isnt really hard to beat orks as Chaos to begin with unless you play brawler chaos or Ork are doin some really cheezy shit (like camping in a corner spamming torps as defender or spamming Nova Cannons)

Slanneshes promise lasts for 30 seconds.

I Just do a rough guess really. Good Tip would be to look at the (mission timer) for longer abilities like that.

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Ashardalon
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Re: Slannesh spam hard counters the shit out of Space Marines.

Postby Ashardalon » 02 October 2016, 06:07

only tzeensh is a problem for my build and surprisingly nurgle battleships sometimes give me trouble (they take too long to die giving the rest time)
thanks for the tip didnt consider mission timer, usually try to use the ability cooldown to try and keep track but when keeping more than 1 active or targetting more then one i kinda lose track

doesnt sound like a very experienced SM player, good SM players know their BB's and can aim them like no other
although it does sound like a strat thats not often used vs them so maybe you kept him on the backfoot with something new to deal with

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Re: Slannesh spam hard counters the shit out of Space Marines.

Postby Pleb Squasher » 02 October 2016, 07:56

MYNAME? wrote:OK so i havnt played in months. so i decided to roll with decked out Desolator MoS and 4 hellbringers MoS vs this Space Marine guy. Not sure if he was any good or not. Anyway this doesnt take away from my analysis or whatever.

Lets look at the Space Marine Faction.

Decent ships with ok guns and an overliability on boarding (Boarding, Lightning strikes, Boarding Torpedos)
Fast
Bloody EXPENSIVE.
Hard as nails.
I am pretty sure the Space Marines fair very well in TT But not against some Races in BFG.

In a 700 point game while i had 5 ships he was barely able to bring out a Battle Barge and 2 Cruisers. I literally cheezed him to death.

Space Marines main form of damage is done with boarding (Ability based) MoS prevents abilities from happening. By chain Slanneshing him i effectivly cancelled out a giant chunk of his DPS/DPM. with 5 fully functional ships i just simply made the Barge irrelevant. He quit on the spot when he noticed what i was doing which was pretty much trolling at that point. It was bad enough that he couldnt even touch me with his ordnance and torpedos in the first place. He didnt have enough ships to put out enough damage to counteract the debuff.

What do you guys think should be done to Prevent this from being so severe.

My solution is to tone down the MoS Debuff. Maybe reduce it by 15 seconds so ships cant be chained indefinantly. OR Make Space Marine ships slightly cheaper.

MoS on a few ships is not OP I agree but when you have it on 5 or 6 ships it gets kind of Rediculous. An ability that can Hard Counter 2 races (Orks and SM) is just no good to me)


This a good example highlighting how Chaos favours can have overly dramatic active effects on the battlefield. Slaanesh fucks up anyone who relies on anything other than standard autofire weaponry. Nurgle makes it impossible to brawl Chaos (due to the insane damage it does which ignores shields and armour while Tzeentch really hurts Eldar, as a Chaos player can hide their entire fleet with just one ship running silent due to the cloud.
Obviously Khorne isn't an issue as it just provides stats buffs, however how often do you see Khorne used in competitive games?Almost never. I think that should make it clear the problem we have.

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Ashardalon
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Re: Slannesh spam hard counters the shit out of Space Marines.

Postby Ashardalon » 02 October 2016, 16:29

This a good example highlighting how Chaos favours can have overly dramatic active effects on the battlefield. Slaanesh fucks up anyone who relies on anything other than standard autofire weaponry. Nurgle makes it impossible to brawl Chaos (due to the insane damage it does which ignores shields and armour while Tzeentch really hurts Eldar, as a Chaos player can hide their entire fleet with just one ship running silent due to the cloud.
Obviously Khorne isn't an issue as it just provides stats buffs, however how often do you see Khorne used in competitive games?Almost never. I think that should make it clear the problem we have.


jep and without those chaos ships are crap
try it
imps can do fine without favor, eldar are still deadly without favor,same for tau
chaos needs to bend their entire playstyle to the favors they have
try brawling with tzeensh, even with the right ships and the right upgrades you will die

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Ahzek Ahriman
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Re: Slannesh spam hard counters the shit out of Space Marines.

Postby Ahzek Ahriman » 02 October 2016, 18:52

Ashardalon wrote:
This a good example highlighting how Chaos favours can have overly dramatic active effects on the battlefield. Slaanesh fucks up anyone who relies on anything other than standard autofire weaponry. Nurgle makes it impossible to brawl Chaos (due to the insane damage it does which ignores shields and armour while Tzeentch really hurts Eldar, as a Chaos player can hide their entire fleet with just one ship running silent due to the cloud.
Obviously Khorne isn't an issue as it just provides stats buffs, however how often do you see Khorne used in competitive games?Almost never. I think that should make it clear the problem we have.


jep and without those chaos ships are crap
try it
imps can do fine without favor, eldar are still deadly without favor,same for tau
chaos needs to bend their entire playstyle to the favors they have
try brawling with tzeensh, even with the right ships and the right upgrades you will die


Or lance kiting with papa Nurgle :)
The sentence below is true
Spoiler : :
The sentence above is false

MYNAME?
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Re: Slannesh spam hard counters the shit out of Space Marines.

Postby MYNAME? » 03 October 2016, 03:24

Ashardalon wrote:only tzeensh is a problem for my build and surprisingly nurgle battleships sometimes give me trouble (they take too long to die giving the rest time)
thanks for the tip didnt consider mission timer, usually try to use the ability cooldown to try and keep track but when keeping more than 1 active or targetting more then one i kinda lose track

doesnt sound like a very experienced SM player, good SM players know their BB's and can aim them like no other
although it does sound like a strat thats not often used vs them so maybe you kept him on the backfoot with something new to deal with


Well i was sneaky and used astroid fields to lure him in and he made the mistake of spreading his ships out tryin to flank from both sides while my desolator hid in the field. making me insta gib one of his ships and as SM that just aint acceptable

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Re: Slannesh spam hard counters the shit out of Space Marines.

Postby MYNAME? » 03 October 2016, 03:26

Ashardalon wrote:
This a good example highlighting how Chaos favours can have overly dramatic active effects on the battlefield. Slaanesh fucks up anyone who relies on anything other than standard autofire weaponry. Nurgle makes it impossible to brawl Chaos (due to the insane damage it does which ignores shields and armour while Tzeentch really hurts Eldar, as a Chaos player can hide their entire fleet with just one ship running silent due to the cloud.
Obviously Khorne isn't an issue as it just provides stats buffs, however how often do you see Khorne used in competitive games?Almost never. I think that should make it clear the problem we have.


jep and without those chaos ships are crap
try it
imps can do fine without favor, eldar are still deadly without favor,same for tau
chaos needs to bend their entire playstyle to the favors they have
try brawling with tzeensh, even with the right ships and the right upgrades you will die


I roll with 2 MoK Acherons 1 Tzeentch Dev and one SLannesh dev cause im a dirty gamer hipster.

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Re: Slannesh spam hard counters the shit out of Space Marines.

Postby MYNAME? » 03 October 2016, 03:39

Its possible to win with Markless chaos ships but you literally have to play to their advantages... meaning lance fleet. You wont have a chance any other way.


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