Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

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Re: Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

Postby MYNAME? » 21 July 2016, 07:36

ApostleOfExcess wrote:
Ahzek Ahriman wrote:
If Zzzaps are ment for "utility" then snare and shield bypass upgrade would or should become inherent attributes of the weapons

Otherwise all this nerf will do is turn Zzzaps into slow weapons that require 2 mandatory upgrades to be useful


And that is what is going to happen in the next patch. Zzzaps are going to go from meta thing to total obsolity, which is another bad extreme.

I would like for zzzaps to have a disruptive role, higher crit chance and in-built slow, retaining bypass-shield as an upgrade.

It would probably allow for zzzap boats as support ships, but without allowing for current cancer zzzap spam.


If they just end up nerfing Zzzaps and leaving it at that, I'm just going throw my hands in the air and uninstall the game. I will have lost confidence that the game will ever be balanced. I don't play Orks, but they shouldn't have to resort to cheese to win, nor should they be treated like an abused spouse every time they log in.

Sometimes I log in and play, but that's only because my fleet - Chaos - is fairly well balanced and enjoyable (lances need nerf tho). The IN is also pretty good, although certain aspects are pretty broke.

Space Marines, Orks, and Eldar all need serious work done to them. This is pretty obvious to be a negative, because 90% of my games are Chaos vs. IN or Chaos vs. Chaos.[/quote]

I agree with your points zapp need a nurf but need to be reworked in having passive shield pierce and snare.

Why do lances need a nurf? You literally need to focus fire with lances in order to kill things at a decent rate. I go with lance fleets and the thought of nurfing lances is heresy lol. Low damage ( but reliable) but start losing to macros at 9 k. Imperial lances need a range buff to have the option to get 12 k lances (this will make fielding gothics more likely) I think chaos lances are in a good spot. They are not overpowering.

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Ahzek Ahriman
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Re: Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

Postby Ahzek Ahriman » 21 July 2016, 22:38

MYNAME? wrote:Why do lances need a nurf? You literally need to focus fire with lances in order to kill things at a decent rate. I go with lance fleets and the thought of nurfing lances is heresy lol. Low damage ( but reliable) but start losing to macros at 9 k. Imperial lances need a range buff to have the option to get 12 k lances (this will make fielding gothics more likely) I think chaos lances are in a good spot. They are not overpowering.


Imo chaos with their lances are by far the most stable thing in the game, I would even say a benchmark to which everything else should be accordingly adopted and compared to.

Only people who frequently play against chaos, especially SM cry about them, and that is just typical "I don't like this and that, NURF IT!".
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Re: Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

Postby Imperator5 » 21 July 2016, 23:03

Ahzek Ahriman wrote:
MYNAME? wrote:Why do lances need a nurf? You literally need to focus fire with lances in order to kill things at a decent rate. I go with lance fleets and the thought of nurfing lances is heresy lol. Low damage ( but reliable) but start losing to macros at 9 k. Imperial lances need a range buff to have the option to get 12 k lances (this will make fielding gothics more likely) I think chaos lances are in a good spot. They are not overpowering.


Imo chaos with their lances are by far the most stable thing in the game, I would even say a benchmark to which everything else should be accordingly adopted and compared to.

Only people who frequently play against chaos, especially SM cry about them, and that is just typical "I don't like this and that, NURF IT!".



SM only need more health. Lances take away their armour too much.
http://forum.battlefleetgothic-armada.com/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=621

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Ahzek Ahriman
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Re: Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

Postby Ahzek Ahriman » 21 July 2016, 23:14

Imperator5 wrote:
Ahzek Ahriman wrote:
MYNAME? wrote:Why do lances need a nurf? You literally need to focus fire with lances in order to kill things at a decent rate. I go with lance fleets and the thought of nurfing lances is heresy lol. Low damage ( but reliable) but start losing to macros at 9 k. Imperial lances need a range buff to have the option to get 12 k lances (this will make fielding gothics more likely) I think chaos lances are in a good spot. They are not overpowering.


Imo chaos with their lances are by far the most stable thing in the game, I would even say a benchmark to which everything else should be accordingly adopted and compared to.

Only people who frequently play against chaos, especially SM cry about them, and that is just typical "I don't like this and that, NURF IT!".



SM only need more health. Lances take away their armour too much.


I'm inclined to agree, but modifying their AP properties into -25 would severely nerf them against IN and orkz (75 armour on the prow, and that is where lances strike a lot). SM definitely would benefit a lot from more health, and that wouldn't even be going from one extreme to another (khy khy... orkz... khy khy...), as long as health increase is reasonable.
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Re: Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

Postby ApostleOfExcess » 22 July 2016, 00:00

Ahzek Ahriman wrote:
MYNAME? wrote:Why do lances need a nurf? You literally need to focus fire with lances in order to kill things at a decent rate. I go with lance fleets and the thought of nurfing lances is heresy lol. Low damage ( but reliable) but start losing to macros at 9 k. Imperial lances need a range buff to have the option to get 12 k lances (this will make fielding gothics more likely) I think chaos lances are in a good spot. They are not overpowering.


Imo chaos with their lances are by far the most stable thing in the game, I would even say a benchmark to which everything else should be accordingly adopted and compared to.

Only people who frequently play against chaos, especially SM cry about them, and that is just typical "I don't like this and that, NURF IT!".

I mean I'm just tired of always beating SM in game. I will agree though, they are the most balanced fleet as it stands.

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Re: Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

Postby Ahzek Ahriman » 22 July 2016, 01:40

ApostleOfExcess wrote:
Ahzek Ahriman wrote:
MYNAME? wrote:Why do lances need a nurf? You literally need to focus fire with lances in order to kill things at a decent rate. I go with lance fleets and the thought of nurfing lances is heresy lol. Low damage ( but reliable) but start losing to macros at 9 k. Imperial lances need a range buff to have the option to get 12 k lances (this will make fielding gothics more likely) I think chaos lances are in a good spot. They are not overpowering.


Imo chaos with their lances are by far the most stable thing in the game, I would even say a benchmark to which everything else should be accordingly adopted and compared to.

Only people who frequently play against chaos, especially SM cry about them, and that is just typical "I don't like this and that, NURF IT!".

I mean I'm just tired of always beating SM in game. I will agree though, they are the most balanced fleet as it stands.


A boost to SM ships hull points would do just fine.
Devs tried not to make SM overpowered and offset high armour with lower hull points, which is perfectly viable and often done in games. Tough on the inside but crispy on the outside or squishy inside with tough shell.

The effort most commendable and appreciated, I found it refreshing that after Eldar pulsar disaster there was a new faction that wasn't overpowered right off the bat. But in practice it turned out that SM don't need such weakness to be balanced and HP boost would solve most issues really. Especially Vanguards that frankly, suck Emporers a*s.

Now they'd only need to return Orkz to brawling faction instead of zzzap cancer faction, so that they don't in turn get anally chastised by marines in close quarters.

Still chaos will be superior :twisted: because long distance. But it will be a natural, healthy advantage, not hard-counter, f*ck-you-Astartes-players advantage.

P.S.
I find it really ironic that the most stable and balanced faction is "Chaos" of all things.
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Re: Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

Postby Bludfist » 22 July 2016, 03:45

Ahzek Ahriman wrote:P.S.
I find it really ironic that the most stable and balanced faction is "Chaos" of all things.

Indeed

Chaos has been superior and the strongest factio thus far because they are so god dam versatile, and can play every possible playstyle in the game

from carriers, to kiting and brawling, chaos can do it

they can counter ever faction and respond to any faction as well
Chaos walking into Aldorf be like
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Re: Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

Postby MYNAME? » 22 July 2016, 05:43

ApostleOfExcess wrote:
Ahzek Ahriman wrote:
MYNAME? wrote:Why do lances need a nurf? You literally need to focus fire with lances in order to kill things at a decent rate. I go with lance fleets and the thought of nurfing lances is heresy lol. Low damage ( but reliable) but start losing to macros at 9 k. Imperial lances need a range buff to have the option to get 12 k lances (this will make fielding gothics more likely) I think chaos lances are in a good spot. They are not overpowering.


Imo chaos with their lances are by far the most stable thing in the game, I would even say a benchmark to which everything else should be accordingly adopted and compared to.

Only people who frequently play against chaos, especially SM cry about them, and that is just typical "I don't like this and that, NURF IT!".

I mean I'm just tired of always beating SM in game. I will agree though, they are the most balanced fleet as it stands.


I think they need to just adjust the point value a lil bit so SM can bring 1 more cruiser. SM have the speed and decent enough weapons and bording to give chaos lance fleet a run for their money once they close the gap. Imperials already got then tools to screw with chaos and that solution starts already at LC level.

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Re: Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

Postby Imperator5 » 22 July 2016, 10:28

Ahzek Ahriman wrote:
ApostleOfExcess wrote:
Ahzek Ahriman wrote:
Imo chaos with their lances are by far the most stable thing in the game, I would even say a benchmark to which everything else should be accordingly adopted and compared to.

Only people who frequently play against chaos, especially SM cry about them, and that is just typical "I don't like this and that, NURF IT!".

I mean I'm just tired of always beating SM in game. I will agree though, they are the most balanced fleet as it stands.


A boost to SM ships hull points would do just fine.
Devs tried not to make SM overpowered and offset high armour with lower hull points, which is perfectly viable and often done in games. Tough on the inside but crispy on the outside or squishy inside with tough shell.

The effort most commendable and appreciated, I found it refreshing that after Eldar pulsar disaster there was a new faction that wasn't overpowered right off the bat. But in practice it turned out that SM don't need such weakness to be balanced and HP boost would solve most issues really. Especially Vanguards that frankly, suck Emporers a*s.

Now they'd only need to return Orkz to brawling faction instead of zzzap cancer faction, so that they don't in turn get anally chastised by marines in close quarters.

Still chaos will be superior :twisted: because long distance. But it will be a natural, healthy advantage, not hard-counter, f*ck-you-Astartes-players advantage.

P.S.
I find it really ironic that the most stable and balanced faction is "Chaos" of all things.


Agreed, a health boost to SM ships would pretty much help with it.

So you think The -25 AP macros would be ok for Orks too?
http://forum.battlefleetgothic-armada.com/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=621

Please help me change skirmish to be customisable. Its very important for PVE players.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=515 Mod idea.

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Ahzek Ahriman
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Re: Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

Postby Ahzek Ahriman » 22 July 2016, 13:06

Imperator5 wrote:
So you think The -25 AP macros would be ok for Orks too?


Definitely.
I still can not comprehend why they decided to remove AP upgrade from Orkz in the first place.
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