Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

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malcontent333
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Re: Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

Postby malcontent333 » 19 July 2016, 17:27

The zzap thing is really irritating, but they're our only tool to tackle SM right now. My heavy kannons are almost useless, especially if there's a chapter master in play. They also out board us. Add to that the +100% hull breach and fires and it's no surprise Ork players don't want to close anymore. If I had my way the zzap would lose the range upgrade and a little damage. In exchange, I'd give kannons the range upgrade back and let orks take the modified AP upgrade (reduce armour BY 25%). Maybe reduce the fire and hull breach to +50% and increase the price a bit
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Re: Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

Postby CALiGeR190 » 19 July 2016, 17:35

malcontent333 wrote:The zzap thing is really irritating, but they're our only tool to tackle SM right now. My heavy kannons are almost useless, especially if there's a chapter master in play. They also out board us. Add to that the +100% hull breach and fires and it's no surprise Ork players don't want to close anymore. If I had my way the zzap would lose the range upgrade and a little damage. In exchange, I'd give kannons the range upgrade back and let orks take the modified AP upgrade (reduce armour BY 25%). Maybe reduce the fire and hull breach to +50% and increase the price a bit

Well the closing mechanics and ability to ignore shields and armour aren't going away, just its ability to do significant damage is being reduced. The Zzap will be for utility mainly, and not be a primary source of damage.
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Re: Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

Postby Imperator5 » 19 July 2016, 17:37

Yeah i feel like the -25 AP would not be OP anymore for orks.
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Re: Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

Postby malcontent333 » 19 July 2016, 19:39

CALiGeR190 wrote:Well the closing mechanics and ability to ignore shields and armour aren't going away, just its ability to do significant damage is being reduced. The Zzap will be for utility mainly, and not be a primary source of damage.


I like the zzap for utility, but how are we Ork kaptins going to deal with heavy armour after the nerf? Our ships are already made of matchsticks, and we're the only race that doesn't have any significant AP. I can't wait to see the zzap meta go, but I'm afraid we'll get steamrolled if we don't get any buffs. Plus, I'm irritated that our fleet is being treated as expendable with the looted ship trait and the bonkers big mek, but the penalties for losing ships are no less harsh. I really want to lose the bonkers mek and the price cut, and get some survivability back.
Orkz is never beatin in battle. If we win we win, if we die we die fightin so it don't count. If we legz it we don't die neither, so we can come back for annuver go, see!

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Re: Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

Postby Imperator5 » 19 July 2016, 20:22

malcontent333 wrote:
CALiGeR190 wrote:Well the closing mechanics and ability to ignore shields and armour aren't going away, just its ability to do significant damage is being reduced. The Zzap will be for utility mainly, and not be a primary source of damage.


I like the zzap for utility, but how are we Ork kaptins going to deal with heavy armour after the nerf? Our ships are already made of matchsticks, and we're the only race that doesn't have any significant AP. I can't wait to see the zzap meta go, but I'm afraid we'll get steamrolled if we don't get any buffs. Plus, I'm irritated that our fleet is being treated as expendable with the looted ship trait and the bonkers big mek, but the penalties for losing ships are no less harsh. I really want to lose the bonkers mek and the price cut, and get some survivability back.


Honestly orks are supposed to be an expendable swarm. Perhaps the lessening of the penalties for orks would be a move more in line with the 40k feeling?
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Re: Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

Postby malcontent333 » 19 July 2016, 21:11

Imperator5 wrote:
Honestly orks are supposed to be an expendable swarm. Perhaps the lessening of the penalties for orks would be a move more in line with the 40k feeling?


This would also be acceptable, though I would think it would take more work to implement. Granted, I'm not a programmer and have nothing really to base that on.
Orkz is never beatin in battle. If we win we win, if we die we die fightin so it don't count. If we legz it we don't die neither, so we can come back for annuver go, see!

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Re: Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

Postby Bludfist » 19 July 2016, 22:43

CALiGeR190 wrote:The Zzap will be for utility mainly, and not be a primary source of damage.



If Zzzaps are ment for "utility" then snare and shield bypass upgrade would or should become inherent attributes of the weapons

Otherwise all this nerf will do is turn Zzzaps into slow weapons that require 2 mandatory upgrades to be useful
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Re: Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

Postby Ahzek Ahriman » 19 July 2016, 23:48

Bludfist wrote:
CALiGeR190 wrote:The Zzap will be for utility mainly, and not be a primary source of damage.



If Zzzaps are ment for "utility" then snare and shield bypass upgrade would or should become inherent attributes of the weapons

Otherwise all this nerf will do is turn Zzzaps into slow weapons that require 2 mandatory upgrades to be useful


And that is what is going to happen in the next patch. Zzzaps are going to go from meta thing to total obsolity, which is another bad extreme.

I would like for zzzaps to have a disruptive role, higher crit chance and in-built slow, retaining bypass-shield as an upgrade.

It would probably allow for zzzap boats as support ships, but without allowing for current cancer zzzap spam.

Imperator5 wrote:Yeah i feel like the -25 AP would not be OP anymore for orks.


Although I totally disagreed with giving -25 AP to lances (thread about chaos lances), I absolutely agree with giving Orkz their AP back, in -25 form.

It would be one of those absolutely mandatory upgrades yes, but probably the most important upgrade of any faction. Orks are meant to be murderous in close range after all, not only as boarding faction but also as brawlers even more deadly in closest quarters than IN.
With the taunt gone, both modifications would return them to the form they used to be, but without making them OP.
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Re: Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

Postby ApostleOfExcess » 21 July 2016, 02:38

Ahzek Ahriman wrote:
If Zzzaps are ment for "utility" then snare and shield bypass upgrade would or should become inherent attributes of the weapons

Otherwise all this nerf will do is turn Zzzaps into slow weapons that require 2 mandatory upgrades to be useful


And that is what is going to happen in the next patch. Zzzaps are going to go from meta thing to total obsolity, which is another bad extreme.

I would like for zzzaps to have a disruptive role, higher crit chance and in-built slow, retaining bypass-shield as an upgrade.

It would probably allow for zzzap boats as support ships, but without allowing for current cancer zzzap spam.
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If they just end up nerfing Zzzaps and leaving it at that, I'm just going throw my hands in the air and uninstall the game. I will have lost confidence that the game will ever be balanced. I don't play Orks, but they shouldn't have to resort to cheese to win, nor should they be treated like an abused spouse every time they log in.

Sometimes I log in and play, but that's only because my fleet - Chaos - is fairly well balanced and enjoyable (lances need nerf tho). The IN is also pretty good, although certain aspects are pretty broke.

Space Marines, Orks, and Eldar all need serious work done to them. This is pretty obvious to be a negative, because 90% of my games are Chaos vs. IN or Chaos vs. Chaos.

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Re: Could Ork zzap abuse perhaps get fixed?

Postby MYNAME? » 21 July 2016, 07:24

Bludfist wrote:
CALiGeR190 wrote:The Zzap will be for utility mainly, and not be a primary source of damage.



If Zzzaps are ment for "utility" then snare and shield bypass upgrade would or should become inherent attributes of the weapons

Otherwise all this nerf will do is turn Zzzaps into slow weapons that require 2 mandatory upgrades to be useful


Agree as always. One can only hope they do this.


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