Change skirmish to be customisable. Or give custom games persistance

Share your ideas and suggestions for Battlefleet Gothic: Armada.
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Imperator5
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Change skirmish to be customisable. Or give custom games persistance

Postby Imperator5 » 11 March 2016, 13:55

Skirmish games need to be able to let you select your enemy, points value, scenario.

Skirmish is for PVE players. Its NOT PVP training. Some people dislike PVP gameplay and may want to play against computer opponents.

For example, Imperial Navy vs Imperial Navy and Eldar vs Eldar is usually very lore breaking, and in PVE skirmish you should be able to avoid it.

This is a very serious issue. Almost ALL strategy games let you do this. I don't know why its different here, but this is not good at all.

Please change it, as it is a very, very, very important part of PVE gamers' expectations.

Devs say its not just a beta restriction, but I consider this extremely bad for PVE players.

Proposed system:

Enemy race: Eldar, ork, chaos, imperial, space marine, random
Map: Map list or random
Game mode: random or selected game mode(s)
Point value: random or selected. Would be better to have more than 1000 point games too.


Giving you the ability to choose enemy, maps, and race in skirmish has been in all these games:

Age of Empires 1,2, age of mythology and its Star wars spinoff Galactic battlegrounds
Star wars Empire at War
Hegemony Legions of Steel
Grey Goo
Company of Heroes
Dawn of War 1 and 2
W40k Armageddon
Starcraft 1 and 2
Warcraft 2 and 3
Heroes of Might and Magic I think so (not sure on this one)
Command and Conquer series, whenever Red alert or Tiberium ones.
Supreme commander

Its a very well established and well received trend. I can't even see the reasoning why its not in yet! Makes no sense.

I have reached such a break in immersion by all the imperial-imperial fights that I'm now just closing the game and restarting if I don't get chaos for the enemy.
Warhammer fans will feel this way, especially imperial and eldar ones, where infighting between fleets is very rare.

If you agree, please put this thread in your signature to spread the word and call attention to the issue.

viewtopic.php?f=16&t=557&p=4969#p4969
Last edited by Imperator5 on 12 March 2016, 12:35, edited 4 times in total.
http://forum.battlefleetgothic-armada.com/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=621

Please help me change skirmish to be customisable. Its very important for PVE players.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=515 Mod idea.

Foofighter
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Re: Change skirmish to be customisable. Or give custom games persistance

Postby Foofighter » 11 March 2016, 14:07

I was.just about to post the same. I am hoping that the options are just locked for the beta? Perhaps the devs could xondiem.

Otherwise this needs another look by the devs as skirmish should be completely customizable.

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aeoluse
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Re: Change skirmish to be customisable. Or give custom games persistance

Postby aeoluse » 11 March 2016, 14:25

I was wondering why the choice was made that you can't make a custom game and that skirmish is just a training mode? Why not just call 'Solo Skirmish' something like 'Solo Training' or 'Multiplayer Training'?

Skirmish is about choice, playing against forces for objectives that you enjoy. Playing with friends to 'comp-stomp' with the biggest units in the game.

I probably won't actually play a lot of the PvP stuff as to be honest I am pretty crap at RTS games, I enjoy them immensely but most players will beat me every time. However, against the computer I can practice and practice to work out their strategies and work out ways of beating them. Only having a PvE mode that is meant to 'train' you with random choices to win in PvP mode will most likely mean I don't play the game after I have done the campaign. I won't be the only one who plays like this and I know a few people who are like me. It could mean that, because of random chance, I could play for hours on end and only ever fight Imperials, or only ever do a death-match, where is the fun in that?!

If you want to force your game to be completely PvP focused then remove the skirmish completely and make it know to begin with that there is no PvE part of the game so people who like that won't buy it. As at the moment you have a whole section of the game that is, quite frankly, crap. As it doesn't train you to fight people, it trains you to fight predictable AI. People are random, AI's are not so much.

Foofighter, from one of Imperator5's other threads this was the response from someone at Focus:

Focus_Jolan wrote:Hi guys.

Sorry for the screen issue.
The game don't supported very well other resolution than 1920*1080 (16:9) but Tindalos is working on it.
It's normal that you don't have "Back" button. Only the "Work in Progress" indication cut is a bug. (And it's already reported ;))

I have to tell you that you'll can't choose your enemy / game type / game size... in skirmish.

Multiplayer mode is a competitive mode, this is why you can't choose your ooponent and game settings.

Solo Skirmish is a "simulation" of Multiplayer mode this is why you can't choose any game settings. It allows you to train in multiplayer conditions.

If you're not agree and you want to do suggestions to Tindalos Team you can do it here: http://forum.battlefleetgothic-armada.com/viewforum.php?f=17

I hope you'll enjoy the beta. :)

Jolan - Focus Team.


It has been a deliberate choice to make it random (and ultimately pointless) and not just locked for Beta. It seems that they only want you to play PvP multiplayer and not have any other game modes or choices of game modes. To lock it down so that it is frustrating, lore-breaking and boring, so that you have no choice but to play PvP Multiplayer.


I agree with both of you, skirmish needs to be completely customisable (races, maps, objectives and all ships) and the ability to play co-op with/against friends with little or no limitations. Its fine to have it separate from PvP Multiplayer completely as it is a completely different mode of the game, just like solo campaign is.

If the Dev's want to see a good skirmish multiplayer system, the best one I have seen is the original Dawn of War and Company of Heroes. DoW still has an active player base in that because it is so good and has vast amounts of re-playability.

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Re: Change skirmish to be customisable. Or give custom games persistance

Postby SpookyBrenda » 11 March 2016, 14:51

I agree. I think it is a bit silly to not be able to customize skirmish games. It's be excellent if there could be four of you, all friends, in a lobby just to mess about and try stuff out in a skirmish game, or pick your points and game mode and face the AI.

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Re: Change skirmish to be customisable. Or give custom games persistance

Postby Godsgopher » 11 March 2016, 15:07

While I defiantly understand that the game is in BETA. Meaning that all systems intended for launch have been implemented and they are simply bug checking and balancing. None the less the random PvP match ups are killing us. Many players are reporting they cant handle the 300-400 point games simple because of dead ships or insufficient points to repair their ships. As well as a few of us such as myself just having a hard time coordinating the separate movements of 4-5 ships in a dogfight. In the boardgame if you take 15 minuets to play your turn you might annoy your opponent a little but hey go get a soda! Here 10 minuets is a really long game.

The bottom line is random point values aren't working and produced a negative experience for a game with quite a bit of potential. As to choosing people for multplayer, yes please! I know I'm not the only guy here who has 40k friends who need to be taking behind the woodshed.

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Imperator5
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Re: Change skirmish to be customisable. Or give custom games persistance

Postby Imperator5 » 11 March 2016, 15:15

I understand why its not customisable for Alpha, CTT or Beta since they want us to test all game modes in PVE.

However, this feature is a must for release. I can not stress it how important this is to the PVE community.

If Skirmish customisation with persistance admiralty system is implemented, I'll buy all DLCs. If not... I don't see myself doing anything other than the campaign, and this makes me very sad. This game is amazing, and it just needs a few imporant tweaks.
http://forum.battlefleetgothic-armada.com/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=621

Please help me change skirmish to be customisable. Its very important for PVE players.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=515 Mod idea.

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aeoluse
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Re: Change skirmish to be customisable. Or give custom games persistance

Postby aeoluse » 11 March 2016, 15:53

Imperator5 wrote:I understand why its not customisable for Alpha, CTT or Beta since they want us to test all game modes in PVE.


I honestly don't understand. I can understand why the campaign isn't playable. Surely they want to know their AI is good and not easily exploitable (which it might be if you have a particular combination of upgrades) for the campaign. Being able to mess with your fittings and being able to play with every ship against every ship will show up a load of bugs and issues with their AI.

Imperator5 wrote:However, this feature is a must for release. I can not stress it how important this is to the PVE community.

If Skirmish customisation with persistance admiralty system is implemented, I'll buy all DLCs. If not... I don't see myself doing anything other than the campaign, and this makes me very sad. This game is amazing, and it just needs a few imporant tweaks.


I have been talking to a friend and really if it isn't implemented then both of us will complete the campaign and most likely uninstall the game.

The random PvP fight grind can be fun for some but if its the only thing that can be done repeatedly (apart from trying the campaign on the harder levels) then the chance of people still playing the game in large quantities this time next year, I would probably bet is slim to none. Yes there will be a small group of players who will still be playing and most likely be very good, but the low to middle group will be almost non-existent. And the casual's...ha not a chance.

Without the ability to play for fun with your friends, I just don't see the game surviving very long with any meaningful community. Being king of the PvP castle is great, but if you aren't very good (which I know I am not) then being stomped once you are past the initial few rounds is really quite demoralising and boring.

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aeoluse
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Re: Change skirmish to be customisable. Or give custom games persistance

Postby aeoluse » 11 March 2016, 16:09

Godsgopher wrote:While I defiantly understand that the game is in BETA. Meaning that all systems intended for launch have been implemented and they are simply bug checking and balancing.


The point of beta is to iron out the bugs and ensure the balancing is right. But someone, at some point, sat down and decided that this was only going to be a PvP multiplayer game. I would love to know the reasoning behind that decision and how they felt that it would mean that they ensured the most amount of re-playability and player retainment. Why, to them, is it that the only game modes that are worth playing are solo campaign and PvP multiplayer.

You can't play skirmish with a friend and you can't co-op the campaign. Apparently, according to the devs, co-op PvE is a mode of the game that people don't play.

Godsgopher wrote:The bottom line is random point values aren't working and produced a negative experience for a game with quite a bit of potential. As to choosing people for multplayer, yes please! I know I'm not the only guy here who has 40k friends who need to be taking behind the woodshed.


Hopefully they aren't too deaf to hear the feedback that they are getting.


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Gardner295
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Re: Change skirmish to be customisable. Or give custom games persistance

Postby Gardner295 » 11 March 2016, 17:21

Maybe it's just me but I'm totally not worrying about it.
There's a "Custom Game" option in the main menu greyed out.
I strongly believe this is akin to selecting game modes, enemy faction, pve or pvp and so on.
As Imperator and other players around here, I'm mostly a single, PvE player and this feature is what really matters to me (aside from the campaign).

When you're selecting ships to add to your fleet just before you hit "Ready" and start the skirmish, you can actually hover the mouse on the skirmish options. You will see that those question marks ("?") react as buttons, and if clicked they will respond (nothing will happen but they will react as pressed)

What I'm trying to say is that the possibilities of having only random pve matches is extremely low.
A lot of content is actually locked because this is, after all, a multiplayer beta, designed to test the stress of connections and resolve multiplayer related problems (like all of those complaining about match ups and losing streaks, but this is OT)
"Hold Fast!" "They're killing us!" "So kill them back!"


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