Chaos Marines

Share your ideas and suggestions for Battlefleet Gothic: Armada.
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WheelJerk
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Chaos Marines

Postby WheelJerk » 23 June 2016, 21:46

Can we get some chaos marines up in this piece?
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ErikModi
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Re: Chaos Marines

Postby ErikModi » 23 June 2016, 22:43

We have them. Chaos Ships with the Chaos Space Marines upgrade.

Chaos Space Marines don't have their own unique ships, like the Imperial Space Marines do, because they're using the same ships they used before and during the Horus Heresy. After that, the Imperium decided that the Space Marines really shouldn't have a large, powerful navy, limiting their ability to do damage should significant numbers of them turn to Chaos again (same reason they were broken up from gigantic Legions into much smaller Chapters). There just aren't Chaos Strike Cruisers and Battle Barges. Or more accurately, Chaos Strike Cruisers are regular cruisers with Chaos Space Marines, and Chaos Battle Barges are heavy cruisers, grand cruisers, or battleships with Chaos Space Marines.

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WheelJerk
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Re: Chaos Marines

Postby WheelJerk » 23 June 2016, 23:14

you can get Adeptus Astartes as a favor. You should be able to get chaos marines as a favor as well.
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Ahzek Ahriman
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Re: Chaos Marines

Postby Ahzek Ahriman » 24 June 2016, 00:06

WheelJerk wrote:you can get Adeptus Astartes as a favor. You should be able to get chaos marines as a favor as well.


Chaos marines of which deity? Shall we give chaos 9 favours? 4 as it is now + 5 chaos marine versions including undivided?
For chaos distinction into different chaos gods is more important than distinction between LATD and marines.
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Re: Chaos Marines

Postby ErikModi » 24 June 2016, 02:23

While I agree the current "Chaos Space Marines" upgrade is a tad underwhelming, especially considering the advantages a Chaos Space Marine Crew gave in tabletop, putting it in as a Favor would undermine the current Chaos Mark favor. Unless the bundled Chaos Space Marine advantages under Chaos Marks, which would risk making them too powerful.

But as it stands, most of the Chaos Space Marine benefits from tabletop aren't really important in this game. To whit:

Tabletop: +1 Leadership. Armada: Leadership was used to making Command tests to go on Special Orders, which really isn't a thing in this game. Leadership seems to be rolled into morale and chances for insubordination, and Chaos crews already seem pretty disciplined (mine rarely go Insubordinate), so adding to morale wouldn't be worth much.

Tabletop: +2 to Boarding Actions. Armada: Not really covered.

Tabletop: -1 to enemy Teleport Attacks. Armada: Covered by the decreased Troop Value to Lightning Strikes and Boarding Actions.

Tabletop: +1 to Teleport Attacks: Armada: Not really covered.

Tabletop: Score 2 Assault Points in Planetary Assault scenarios instead of 1. Armada: Planetary Assault is a completely different animal in this game, so the bonus doesn't really apply.

Tabletop: Optional Chosen Terminators (costs extra points), roll two dice for Teleport Attacks and pick one. Armada: Pretty much covered with Additional Teleportarium.

So, the only things that aren't really affected in Armada that could be are basically increasing Troop Value, which would already step on the toes of Nurgle and Khorne favors. Say, for example, adding Chaos Space Marine benefits to the existing Favors, turning them into the following:

World Eaters Favor: Combines Mark of Khorne with Chaos Space Marines.
Emperor's Children Favor: Combines Mark of Slaanesh with Chaos Space Marines.
Death Guard Favor: Combines Mark of Nurgle with Chaos Space Marines.
Thousand Sons Favor: Combines Mark of Tzeentch with Chaos Space Marines.

Each would increase Troop Value by a given amount (representing the Chaos Space Marine crew itself), but then Mark of Khorne and Mark of Nurgle would just increase that value by another amount. So those would still be the "best" Favors to pick if you're running a fleet that focuses on lightning strikes/assault boats/boarding, and the other Favors still wouldn't matter. So, no reason to retool things greatly for Chaos Space Marines.

Which is kind of sad, because I agree in principle adding Chaos Space Marines to a Chaos ship's crew should have a greater impact, but I just don't see how it can easily and non-game-breakingly be implemented.

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WheelJerk
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Re: Chaos Marines

Postby WheelJerk » 24 June 2016, 16:19

Ahzek Ahriman wrote:
WheelJerk wrote:you can get Adeptus Astartes as a favor. You should be able to get chaos marines as a favor as well.


Chaos marines of which deity? Shall we give chaos 9 favours? 4 as it is now + 5 chaos marine versions including undivided?
For chaos distinction into different chaos gods is more important than distinction between LATD and marines.



It's Abaddon's black crusade. So the black legion makes sense. And then you can get black and gold chaos ships instead of the default red.
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Cryhavok
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Re: Chaos Marines

Postby Cryhavok » 24 June 2016, 17:12

WheelJerk wrote:
Ahzek Ahriman wrote:
WheelJerk wrote:you can get Adeptus Astartes as a favor. You should be able to get chaos marines as a favor as well.


Chaos marines of which deity? Shall we give chaos 9 favours? 4 as it is now + 5 chaos marine versions including undivided?
For chaos distinction into different chaos gods is more important than distinction between LATD and marines.



It's Abaddon's black crusade. So the black legion makes sense. And then you can get black and gold chaos ships instead of the default red.

Isn't the default red supposed to be word bearers legion?
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Ahzek Ahriman
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Re: Chaos Marines

Postby Ahzek Ahriman » 24 June 2016, 17:50

WheelJerk wrote:
Ahzek Ahriman wrote:
WheelJerk wrote:you can get Adeptus Astartes as a favor. You should be able to get chaos marines as a favor as well.


Chaos marines of which deity? Shall we give chaos 9 favours? 4 as it is now + 5 chaos marine versions including undivided?
For chaos distinction into different chaos gods is more important than distinction between LATD and marines.



It's Abaddon's black crusade. So the black legion makes sense. And then you can get black and gold chaos ships instead of the default red.


If we do it this way I'd much lean towards the separate legions suggestion, World Eaters/Death Guard/Emps Children/Thousand Sons and give them current bonuses plus some bonus to troops/assault. Though this'd kill some of the customization factor of the fleet.
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WheelJerk
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Re: Chaos Marines

Postby WheelJerk » 24 June 2016, 17:52

Thousand sons would be Su-weet!
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WheelJerk
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Re: Chaos Marines

Postby WheelJerk » 24 June 2016, 17:54

Cryhavok wrote:
WheelJerk wrote:
Ahzek Ahriman wrote:
Chaos marines of which deity? Shall we give chaos 9 favours? 4 as it is now + 5 chaos marine versions including undivided?
For chaos distinction into different chaos gods is more important than distinction between LATD and marines.



It's Abaddon's black crusade. So the black legion makes sense. And then you can get black and gold chaos ships instead of the default red.

Isn't the default red supposed to be word bearers legion?


indeed, but I don't think they're all word bearer ships.
Ave Dominus Nox.


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